tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post1759706569383521811..comments2023-10-17T10:45:07.796-04:00Comments on FJB: Frank Wren and John Schuerholz Need a Diaper ChangeUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-30532550832261679012008-12-22T17:43:00.000-05:002008-12-22T17:43:00.000-05:00Also--I agree that the Braves are perfectly within...Also--I agree that the Braves are perfectly within their right to refuse to do business with the Wasserman group in the future. I think that would be a self-defeating, petulant move that would only hurt the Braves, but they can do that if they want. I agree with you both there.<BR/><BR/>And James you're probably right that a former GM would be the best person to tell us what the convention is, but who's going to tell us that Rafael Furcal agreed to play by those rules? Why should he be bound by some convention established by some dudes decades ago?Stevenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14109288910583404941noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-7735296935574684042008-12-22T17:40:00.000-05:002008-12-22T17:40:00.000-05:00Let me elaborate. I think that the "convention" yo...Let me elaborate. <BR/><BR/>I think that the "convention" you reference probably is real, but it is a relic of an old boy's culture in baseball that went hand-in-hand with owners calling all the shots and players getting treated like field hands.<BR/><BR/>The convention in business--and the law--is that you have a deal when you sign on the dotted line. MLB isn't a country club and baseball players aren't caddies. And the Braves didn't have a deal because Raffy's name wasn't on the dotted line. All this crying about how agents are such tough negotiators and how despicable it is that the agents (gasp!) used one team's offer to get a few more million of another!! It's just the whining of people who still haven't gotten used to the fact that they don't have total unchecked power over everything.<BR/><BR/>Sorry, that's how I see it.<BR/><BR/>BTW--I think Bowden's track record of publicly dissing players (Cordero), firing the manager he hired 50 days into the season, showboating in the press and publicly dissing other GMs... these are classless, disrespectful moves that go in a totally different category.Stevenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14109288910583404941noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-2261321960484517622008-12-22T16:32:00.000-05:002008-12-22T16:32:00.000-05:00What James Bjork said. Steven, you can't seriousl...What James Bjork said. Steven, you can't seriously believe anybody is arguing that transmittal of a term sheet = a binding contract.<BR/><BR/>Where I guess I differ with James Bjork is that I don't have a problem with GMs dumping on a particular agent publicly, if that's what they think best serves their client, just as Steven contends that an agent should act in a way that best serves the interests of their client.<BR/><BR/>The Atlanta boys (rightly or wrongly) feel cheated in the way Furcal's agents shopped the Atlanta terms. They reasonably might conclude that the best move for their client is to make a spectacle out of it and take a hard line that they won't deal with these guys any more. That might be the best service to their client, or it might not, but there's nothing wrong with doing it. In the same vein, agents now and then completely dump on an organization, and sometimes that's the best move for their clients and sometimes not.John O'Connorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08014476389355562158noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-91685389545911522382008-12-22T16:14:00.000-05:002008-12-22T16:14:00.000-05:00Steven, you're making a straw man argument. I...Steven, you're making a straw man argument. I'm not defending W&S because I somehow believe that a mere offer constitutes an actual agreement, per se. If the convention is that agents ask for a signed terms sheet only when the player essentially agrees to the terms, and the convention is also that such documents are not actually shared with other clubs' GMs as a negotiating prop, then I can understand where W&S would be angry.<BR/><BR/>I have yet to see any agent or GM come out and refute the alleged unconventionality of what Furcal's agents did. Then again, current GMs don't want to piss off a potential trading partner. I'd give the most credence on this to what a former GM would say.<BR/><BR/>In a sense though, that's neither here nor there. W&S should not have whined about it so vociferously.James Bjorkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12300788103065851752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-29459355854964640912008-12-22T14:58:00.000-05:002008-12-22T14:58:00.000-05:00Baseball Prospectus sums it up well in their headl...Baseball Prospectus sums it up well in their headline in This Week in Quotes: "Maybe He Can Pen a Tearful Chapter about It in the Paperback Edition of His Brilliant Book." (If you haven't yet read Schuerholz' <I>Built to Win</I>, it's not too late to leave it off your holiday wish list.)<BR/><BR/>Schuerholz needs to get a grip, or get out, before he really does turn the Braves into a laughingstock. At the very least the Liberty people need to sit him down and give him a talking to.Mikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01915120760049904431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-18142207991624740122008-12-22T14:50:00.000-05:002008-12-22T14:50:00.000-05:00The "convention" is that *receiving* a fax of an o...The "convention" is that *receiving* a fax of an offer sheet is the same as a signed contract? C'mon. You guys can't really believe that. Let's fax Tex a contract right now! If it goes through, we know we're in business!!!Stevenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14109288910583404941noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-73802067309102830292008-12-22T14:42:00.000-05:002008-12-22T14:42:00.000-05:00Hang on, now; if an offer sheet can be enforced as...Hang on, now; if an offer sheet can be enforced as a unilateral demand, free agency just went out the window.<BR/><BR/>Schuerholz and Wren have the right to throw a fit, and the other 29 teams have a right to take advantage of their petulance. Who will want to go to Atlanta if their FO's attitude is "take it or leave it"?<BR/><BR/>I'm not feeling that this situation is equivalent to the Crow misfire at all.Mikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01915120760049904431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-27997890438067778442008-12-22T13:49:00.000-05:002008-12-22T13:49:00.000-05:00Steven I agree with James, your number 4 point for...Steven I agree with James, your number 4 point for firing Bowden is how he leaks items and back stabs players, agents and other GM's. Why is it ok for an agent to do it and get more money for them as well as that one client, but its not ok for a team to do it to save money for an entire organization. <BR/><BR/>If Wren and Schuerholz are correct by the events than they do have a right to be upset and take action against the Wasserman Media Group. There must be a level of decourm when it comes to negotiations. We saw the debacle of the Crow talks first hand. Here its even worse b/c they broke protocal by asking for the offer sheet than signing with the dodgers.Steve Shouphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08995967113869172494noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-1192128165662161422008-12-22T10:18:00.000-05:002008-12-22T10:18:00.000-05:00Peons like us have no idea what the inner workings...Peons like us have no idea what the inner workings and style and procedures of these negotiations are like. Until refuted by other GMs, I'll assume that what Furcal's agents did with the *written offer document* was indeed unconventional and in poor taste relative to standard operating procedures, even though they were told Furcal would "sleep on it." Were W&S ever given a chance to come back with something better to match LA? I don't know that they were. It seems from press accounts that they sent the written offer, and woke up the next day to see Furcal to LA. I'd be pissed too.<BR/><BR/>That said, Wren and Schuerholz were dumb in coming out publicly like a couple of petulant whiners. If I were them, I would make a vague statement about being "disappointed in how the negotiations were conducted" and utter no further peep. Let people's imaginations do the rest.<BR/><BR/>I think to be consistent, you have to argue for the same cryptic communication strategy among GMs not wanting to deal with Bowden.<BR/><BR/>To glom onto actual call-out quotes from other GMs about Bowden based on his uncouth (but self-interested and legal) practices but chastise Wren and Schuerholz seems inconsistent to me, even though the target of the rhetoric is a GM in one case, an agent the other.James Bjorkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12300788103065851752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2074246508221440257.post-79494969726857219482008-12-22T10:14:00.000-05:002008-12-22T10:14:00.000-05:00I don't agree. It sounds to me that there is an a...I don't agree. It sounds to me that there is an accepted course of dealing that the term sheet is circulated to document the deal already agreed to. I haven't really seen a serious contention otherwise.<BR/><BR/>But that doesn't even really matter here. Whether that's the accepted convention or not, the Braves are using there rights in the market not to deal with someone who doesn't follow that convention. If the agents are free to push as hard as they want, both in public and through their negotiation tactics, then I guess the Braves can too.John O'Connorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08014476389355562158noreply@blogger.com